1098 The Damned

Discuss DVDs and Blu-rays released by Criterion and the films on them. If it's got a spine number, it's in here. Threads may contain spoilers.
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dwk
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Re: 1098 The Damned

#51 Post by dwk » Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:08 pm

That is what I meant yoloswegmaster, the elements are in Italy not in the US and, as tenia said, the Italian owners obviously wanted to use Ritrovata to scan, restore and grade the new master. Unfortunately.

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L.A.
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Re: 1098 The Damned

#52 Post by L.A. » Tue Sep 28, 2021 12:26 pm


Orlac
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Re: 1098 The Damned

#53 Post by Orlac » Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:27 am


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tenia
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Re: 1098 The Damned

#54 Post by tenia » Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:50 am

The usual crusade against this kind of grading, as if such a restoration deserves a 1.75 out of 5.
Interestingly, the caps from the older DVD aren't very convincing either, several of them showing a visible magenta push, as it was often the case with older restorations.

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Re: 1098 The Damned

#55 Post by Stefan Andersson » Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:59 am

The Damned was previewed at 163 mins. as per Variety review:

https://cinefiles.bampfa.berkeley.edu/catalog/23895

Review has brief info about the financing of the film. Reviewer guesses that the screenplay is a direct translation from Italian to English.

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cdnchris
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Re: 1098 The Damned

#56 Post by cdnchris » Tue Oct 05, 2021 1:05 pm

Orlac wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:27 am
For once, Svet is not impressed - https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/The-Damn ... creenshots
As tenia mentioned, Svet has recently taken up a crusade against this type of colour-grading after not acknowledging it being an issue for so long, but has seemed to go hard the polar opposite to "make up for it" I guess you can say; he's defended a number of Criterion releases in the past, and it doesn't appear to have been as big a concern for him with Death in Venice, which is quite a ways worse than this one, where shadow detail is completely crushed out. I'm not a fan of the colours, and I feel that they're off (can't back it up, though), but 1.75/5 is hyperbole as other aspects of the restoration and presentation are solid. Honestly, I'd still take this over the Warner DVD.

He also came down on La piscine (and also seemed to finally notice the "noise" that can sneak in to some their releases), but that one has a far different look than the "Ritrovata'd" titles. It sticks out, but I'd say it's probably closer to that warm look tenia mentions that other labs have tried to recreate digitally.

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tenia
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Re: 1098 The Damned

#57 Post by tenia » Tue Oct 05, 2021 1:11 pm

I'd say that La piscine looks rather overly saturated and sun-dried than anything drifting in a specific color or color signature.

But that's part of Svet's hyperbolic crusade against these gradings, even more so since they're European so it can also fuels his political agenda. If La piscine's grading was obtained from a US lab, he probably would have voiced a few concerns but would have never come so hard on it. By lumping it together with stuff from Ritrovata and Eclair, he's just mixing everything up together and putting every concern, small or large, at the same level, which makes no sense practically speaking.

And of course, there are no way these restorations should score so low. 1.75 out of 5, that's closer to score given to SD upscales, which this of course isn't at all.

One can certainly questions these gradings and degrade accordingly the scores, but the final score still requires to overall fit the scale of value. This is just insanely hyperbolic.

Death in Venice was reviewed by Neil Lumbard though, this explaining that. But if you go back enough in time, you'll find older reviews from Svet when he wasn't in this crusade and yes indeed, he certainly wasn't bothered as much by these than now (like Pane e Cioccolata, which he even defended when I questioned the grading). And in some cases, he still give passes to some stuff (mostly from Eclair IIRC), probably because he didn't spot it was from his nemesis.

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Re: 1098 The Damned

#58 Post by cdnchris » Tue Oct 05, 2021 1:51 pm

Ah, I keep forgetting he didn't always have exclusivity on Criterion titles there, and seeming to be less so the last little bit.

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tenia
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Re: 1098 The Damned

#59 Post by tenia » Tue Oct 05, 2021 2:46 pm

cdnchris wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 1:51 pm
Ah, I keep forgetting he didn't always have exclusivity on Criterion titles there, and seeming to be less so the last little bit.
It definitely seems like he tried to cover more stuff than he can handle, and ended up with a backlog so big other reviewers had to chime in. Moreover, some of his missing reviews look like titles from labels he didn't want to rant against, so the related titles got to somebody else. Eg : The Tree of Wooden Clogs.

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Re: 1098 The Damned

#60 Post by cdnchris » Tue Oct 05, 2021 5:43 pm

I just noticed he also said this has a more digital look as well. While I guess that could play into his grade, it sort of kills me that he refused to acknowledge past encoding problems on some of their other titles, but then calls out the encoding here when it's actually one of their better recent ones. Or is he trying to blame that on the restoration house? I just don't know anymore...

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david hare
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Re: 1098 The Damned

#61 Post by david hare » Tue Oct 05, 2021 6:05 pm

I don't think he knows either Chris.

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Re: 1098 The Damned

#62 Post by JakeStewart » Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:12 pm

I don’t see how anyone can take him seriously anymore. What with his batshit crazy beliefs, and now his new obsession with trashing almost every restoration coming from Europe. It’s funny that he accuses these restoration houses of “destroying” film history at the same time as he vigilantly tries to discourage people from seeing the actual films.

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tenia
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Re: 1098 The Damned

#63 Post by tenia » Wed Oct 06, 2021 3:24 am

He's speaking of a digital aspect not related to the encode but how the grading looks like something definitely achieved digitally, especially in its handling of darker flat areas. I see what he means and agree with him, though I find Ritrovata's less of an issue than what Eclair can be doing there, especially when they deal with having to raise black levels (see Le jour et l'heure ou La guerre est finie). I've never seen 35mm showings yielding this kind of stuff.

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Re: 1098 The Damned

#64 Post by cdnchris » Wed Oct 06, 2021 9:07 am

Ah, that makes more sense, like how Memories of Murder had that artificial skip-bleach thing applied, leaving the image with this digital sheen. Didn't look natural.

As much as I'm not a fan of the Ritrovata "look" I can't say I've really had that problem with it, though I see where he's coming from. Still funny that it's an issue now.

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