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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:16 pm 
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It's indeed hard not to read this list as just a character in a script which is very nice to him.
He's the nice guy in the movie, and guess what, cool things happen to him and bad things happen to the guys against him.
It just seems like Comedy 101 for me.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:27 pm 
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domino harvey wrote:
Risky Business is an unfunny teen sex comedy with self-important art house window dressing and centers on one of the least tolerable male ego strokings in existence (whore likes guy so much she does it for free). You really want to take the high ground there over this?

Risky Business is barely a teen sex comedy. That may have been the starting point, but it spirals into a film about a North Shore suburban kid's complete corruption. Hughes's films seem like fairy tales in comparison, maybe even embracing the same Reagan-era values that are processed much differently in Risky Business.


Last edited by hearthesilence on Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:47 pm 
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hearthesilence wrote:
Hughes's films seem like fairy tales in comparison.

We can all be thankful for that.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:53 pm 
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mfunk9786 wrote:
hearthesilence wrote:
Hughes's films seem like fairy tales in comparison.

We can all be thankful for that.

I feel like these conflicting sentiments are a reflection of our disagreement over Mad Men, specifically the way that show ended.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:03 pm 
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If you want to see what a nerd looks like in a John Hughes movie, look no further than Anthony Michael Hall in, well, pretty much any other Hughes film. Ferris bears no similarity to AMH's Brian (The Breakfast Club) or Gary (Weird Science) whatsoever.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:25 pm 
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There's no point arguing with calculus entropy. For him, everything makes Ferris Bueller a nerd, including the overwhelming evidence against it! The more inescapably Ferris isn't a nerd, the more plainly he is a nerd. He bears no nerdish traits? Well, then he's the fantasy of nerds, and therefore a nerd (guilty by proxy!). He's cool? Well, nerds are cool now, so Ferris a nerd. The counterpoints are just further evidence of the original point. It's confirmation bias driven to the point of madness. Any further arguments you guys make will just be repurposed into points in his favour.

It's an idée fixe. There isn't an explosive big enough to pry him from it.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:29 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:49 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2014 11:32 am
Mr Sausage wrote:
There's no point arguing...

I guess there's just no way to accommodate another perspective, there? Its the binary internet, and thus any dissonance must be approved by the quorum. Well, perhaps if you considered it and replied with some justification. it would have been more constructive, but I see you've projected that my human failings are the root cause. We resume with mods modding mods, and I will offer no more "arguments" (anything that deviates) from the accepted and obvious "truth".

Mr Sausage, thanks for the ad hominem to give me a reason to desist from this dialog. Sorry for the kerfuffle!

Oh, it's such a perfect day
I'm glad I spent it with you
Oh, such a perfect day
You just keep me hanging on
You just keep me hanging on
Just a perfect day
Problems all left alone
Weekenders on our own
It's such fun
Just a perfect day
You made me forget myself
I thought I was
Someone else, someone good
Oh, it's such a perfect day

I'm glad I spent it with you
Oh,…


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:53 pm 
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mteller wrote:
calculus entrophy wrote:
3) Girlfriend: is unattainably hottest in school: Enough said.
4) Popularity: Did you notice the exaggerated popularity, to the point of surreal, with the "Save Ferris" campaign? Hello, its screaming - this is all far too fantastic, even absurd.
5) The Daydream: First, its all one day. That's significant. Also, didnt you see how "perfect" everything is?? Each plot point turns on somehow, incredibly, it always works out perfect for Ferris, like when he runs by his parents and ends up in bed without ever being noticed - that's totally impossible. Also, when he is in the cab with Mia Sara, he is totally busted, but Mia Sara saves the day somehow through edit-time shifting.
6) Revenge: Did you perhaps notice how maybe all the people that make Ferris life more difficult, all end up in very humiliating situations?

And don't you remember the time you led all of downtown Chicago in a sing along? No, you didn't. Or that time your Ferrari got stolen, and then returned without a scratch? Thought not.

Ferris is just an absurd, fantastic character. Someone who has no past and no future besides this one perfect day. Over and over, everything always works out perfect. Kinda like a super nobody's daydream.


Tons of movies are fantastical and feature things going improbably well for the protagonists, but that doesn't make them nerds.

Agreed. This is just garden variety bad writing of the sort that can be found in countless Hollywood films of the 1980s, and today.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:55 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2014 11:32 am
fiddlesticks wrote:
If you want to see what a nerd looks like in a John Hughes movie, look no further than Anthony Michael Hall in, well, pretty much any other Hughes film. Ferris bears no similarity to AMH's Brian (The Breakfast Club) or Gary (Weird Science) whatsoever.

That was the point I originally made. FBDO was the conclusion of a tremendous run of successful films that depicted outsiders as worthy, and brought them a new "coolness". Prior to that, it was Anthony Michael Hall getting dumped. That was the change to the nerd stereotype prior to FBDO that made it so refreshing.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:59 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2014 11:32 am
zedz wrote:
mteller wrote:
calculus entrophy wrote:
3) Girlfriend: is unattainably hottest in school: Enough said.
4) Popularity: Did you notice the exaggerated popularity, to the point of surreal, with the "Save Ferris" campaign? Hello, its screaming - this is all far too fantastic, even absurd.
5) The Daydream: First, its all one day. That's significant. Also, didnt you see how "perfect" everything is?? Each plot point turns on somehow, incredibly, it always works out perfect for Ferris, like when he runs by his parents and ends up in bed without ever being noticed - that's totally impossible. Also, when he is in the cab with Mia Sara, he is totally busted, but Mia Sara saves the day somehow through edit-time shifting.
6) Revenge: Did you perhaps notice how maybe all the people that make Ferris life more difficult, all end up in very humiliating situations?

And don't you remember the time you led all of downtown Chicago in a sing along? No, you didn't. Or that time your Ferrari got stolen, and then returned without a scratch? Thought not.

Ferris is just an absurd, fantastic character. Someone who has no past and no future besides this one perfect day. Over and over, everything always works out perfect. Kinda like a super nobody's daydream.


Tons of movies are fantastical and feature things going improbably well for the protagonists, but that doesn't make them nerds.

Agreed. This is just garden variety bad writing of the sort that can be found in countless Hollywood films of the 1980s, and today.


That's correct, however my statements don't say that it is improbable, rather they explain why Ferris is clearly a fantasy, ideal projection made obvious again and again, and how that is quite likely aligned with an identity that seeks out all these things.

FBDO is one of a row of movies made by John Hughes that identified the "nerd" as more than a stereotype, and aligned them with very successful, relatable roles.

If you're hung up on the definition of nerd, substitute outsider or loser, whatever. The idea is still the same. Sorry you missed it. Peace out.


Last edited by calculus entrophy on Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:00 pm 
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calculus entrophy wrote:
Mr Sausage wrote:
There's no point arguing...

I guess there's just no way to accommodate another perspective, there? Its the binary internet, and thus any dissonance must be approved by the quorum. Well, perhaps if you considered it and replied with some justification. it would have been more constructive, but I see you've projected that my human failings are the root cause. We resume with mods modding mods, and I will offer no more "arguments" (anything that deviates) from the accepted and obvious "truth".

Mr Sausage, thanks for the ad hominem to give me a reason to desist from this dialog. Sorry for the kerfuffle!

Oh, it's such a perfect day
I'm glad I spent it with you
Oh, such a perfect day
You just keep me hanging on
You just keep me hanging on
Just a perfect day
Problems all left alone
Weekenders on our own
It's such fun
Just a perfect day
You made me forget myself
I thought I was
Someone else, someone good
Oh, it's such a perfect day

I'm glad I spent it with you
Oh,…

This is an amusing post (what I understand of it, anyway) from someone who refuses to entertain anyone else's point of view except of course as further evidence that his own views are right.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:01 pm 
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It's so unbelievably over the top, calculus entrophy must be a teapot.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:02 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2014 11:32 am
So, again with the ad-hominem. I keep providing more basis, and you keep the personal attacks. I don't want to escalate this into where you want to head. Take care.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:04 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2014 11:32 am
swo17 wrote:
It's so unbelievably over the top, calculus entrophy must be a teapot.

Eww... I guess I''ll throw in some gifs memes for the mod squad too, right?


Image


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:05 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 4:43 pm
We've had some bad threads here in the past, but this might just be the most unpleasant one to try to read through ever. Bravo to all!


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:37 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2005 12:56 am
I seem to have been wise in my choices of who to place on my "ignore" list in the past.

BTW I hadn't meant to imply that Risky Business was some kind of model of political sensitivity or something (as if we should want it to be), or to put films to that particular litmus test. But I had a strong sense of Bueller —and other Hughes films—repeatedly punching downward, which gave the pervasive smarminess an unpleasantly triumphalist edge.

I don't actually find Risky Business incredibly funny (although the business with the car—just one of the things swiped for Bueller—is pretty good). I do find its plotting—and the moody confidence of its style—pretty irresistible.

(One thing I learned from Men Don't Leave, Paul Brickman's follow-up, is that the guy might be a one-trick pony. In that film he apes the style of his earlier hit right down to lighting patterns and music cues, but in a very different narrative context it comes across mostly as unearned.)


Last edited by whaleallright on Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:40 pm 
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Location: Great Falls, Montana
calculus entrophy wrote:
Eww... I guess I''ll throw in some gifs memes for the mod squad too, right?

(MEME REDACTED)


*IN LOUD SHRILL NERD VOICE*

THIS ISN'T A GIF! THIS ISN'T A GIF!


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:26 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2005 4:22 am
Location: NYC
I don't see why mfunk is complaining - if anything, Criterion should hire some actors and record this thread as their disc's audio commentary.
whaleallright wrote:
(One thing I learned from Men Don't Leave, Paul Brickman's follow-up, is that the guy might be a one-trick pony. In that film he apes the style of his earlier hit right down to lighting patterns and music cues, but in a very different narrative context it comes across mostly as unearned.)

I didn't realize this until I saw the NYFF Q&A with Jonathan Demme and Paul Le Mat (I posted it in another thread for those who are curious), but Brickman also wrote Citizens Band. He also served as the associate producer, and Demme has an amusing anecdote where Brickman became so intrusive on his creative decisions that one of his producers (or assistant directors?) offered to get run Brickman out of town. The experience may have motivated Brickman to direct a film himself, but regardless, Citizens Band is a favorite and he deserves credit for the script, for which he is solely credited.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:39 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2005 3:31 pm
Location: Indiana
I hope they don't make new artwork for it. Much like The Breakfast Club that poster is pretty iconic and hard to replicate or replace outright.


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