34 Andrei Rublev

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peerpee
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#276 Post by peerpee » Mon Sep 17, 2012 6:42 pm

Another vote. Tarkovsky badly needed on Blu-ray in the West!

The Blu-ray of LETTER NEVER SENT is astonishing and has me hankering after much more Russian cinema on Blu-ray.

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Ashirg
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#277 Post by Ashirg » Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:28 pm

The Mirror has been released on blu-ray in Russia. Alas, no subtitles, but here is a comparison (in Russian). Not impressed.

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jsteffe
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#278 Post by jsteffe » Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:32 pm

Ashirg wrote:The Mirror has been released on blu-ray in Russia. Alas, no subtitles, but here is a comparison (in Russian). Not impressed.
Of all the versions I've seen (including the Blu-ray) I like the coloring on the restored Krupnyi Plan DVD the best. I can't say whether it's the most accurate, though. Also, the Blu-ray seems to have too much grain filtered away.

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Roger Ryan
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#279 Post by Roger Ryan » Tue Sep 18, 2012 8:10 am

Ashirg wrote:...It doesn't look like Mosfilm has any materials for 205-minute version, so they ever acknowledged its existence calling 185-minute version director's cut...
That's not that outrageous of a claim since the 185 minute edit was completed by the director and was, reportedly, his preferred version. Some of the editing / shot choices in the 185 min. edit are, indeed, better than in the 205 minute version. In an ideal world, everyone would have access to a Blu-ray containing both edits which I hope is what Criterion is planning to do eventually (that one existing 205 min. print is of poor enough quality that I imagine a Blu-ray release would be criticized unless the cleaner 185 min. edit was included as well).

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pzadvance
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#280 Post by pzadvance » Fri Oct 05, 2012 12:35 pm

Roger Ryan wrote:
Ashirg wrote:...It doesn't look like Mosfilm has any materials for 205-minute version, so they ever acknowledged its existence calling 185-minute version director's cut...
That's not that outrageous of a claim since the 185 minute edit was completed by the director and was, reportedly, his preferred version. Some of the editing / shot choices in the 185 min. edit are, indeed, better than in the 205 minute version. In an ideal world, everyone would have access to a Blu-ray containing both edits which I hope is what Criterion is planning to do eventually (that one existing 205 min. print is of poor enough quality that I imagine a Blu-ray release would be criticized unless the cleaner 185 min. edit was included as well).
Anyone seen both cuts and have a definite preference for one over the other? I've yet to see it and have the option of watching the 185 min. cut in HD or the 205 min. cut in its muddy SD transfer--curious which I should opt for.

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MichaelB
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#281 Post by MichaelB » Fri Oct 05, 2012 2:24 pm

I'm glad to own copies of both cuts, but I've always personally preferred the 185-minute cut, and that's the one I'm more likely to watch when the mood takes me.

Although Tarkovsky was asked to tone certain things down, there's very little question that he also took the opportunity to improve other, less contentious parts of the film: for instance, I find the prologue considerably more effective in the shorter version.

peerpee
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#282 Post by peerpee » Sun Oct 07, 2012 4:03 pm

Michael, which cut did you see first? I saw the longer Criterion DVD first and have always preferred that cut. I'm going to watch the Blu-ray of the other cut soon though, it's been a while.

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MichaelB
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#283 Post by MichaelB » Sun Oct 07, 2012 4:21 pm

peerpee wrote:Michael, which cut did you see first? I saw the longer Criterion DVD first and have always preferred that cut. I'm going to watch the Blu-ray of the other cut soon though, it's been a while.
The 185-minute cut, several times. So of course it has the virtue of familiarity (for similar reasons, Touch of Evil just sounds "wrong" without the Henry Mancini score), which I obviously can't discount, but...

...well, when I'm less busy, I'll dig out the Criterion DVD and try to articulate just why its version of the prologue has less impact on me.

peerpee
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#284 Post by peerpee » Sun Oct 07, 2012 4:45 pm

I think that both prologues are made from entirely different takes. The differences between both versions are pretty huge. The music is more subtly used on the Criterion, I seem to remember. Again, it's been a while since I did that A-B comparison – but the 185-minute version interrupts that long pan with the jester character and it really stuck in my mind as a shame (because he shows his arse or something?)

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hearthesilence
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#285 Post by hearthesilence » Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:17 pm

Anthology Film Archives on the LES in NYC is screening the "complete director's cut" (the 205-minute version) in 35mm on Friday, April 12, at 7pm, on Sunday, April 14, at 4:30 pm and on Saturday, April 27 at 6:30 pm. General admission is $10.

albucat
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#286 Post by albucat » Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:06 am

I'm hoping someone can attend? I'd be extremely curious to hear about the state of the print, although the very fact of an available 35mm print suggests that usable materials may be more available than previously thought. I'm sure I'm not alone in wishing this film upgraded more than any other Criterion release.

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Roger Ryan
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#287 Post by Roger Ryan » Mon Apr 01, 2013 8:40 am

The Detroit Film Theater showed a 35mm print of the 205 min. RUBLEV last year which curator Elliot Wilhelm claimed was the only one in circulation in the U.S. It looked identical to what Criterion used for the DVD, meaning relatively poor contrast with some damage. I imagine the same print is being shown by the Anthology Film Archives. Still, I wouldn't miss an opportunity to see this on a large screen projected from 35mm as the absence of digital compression artifacts improves the experience quite a bit.

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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#288 Post by remy » Mon Apr 22, 2013 11:02 am

albucat wrote:I'm hoping someone can attend? I'd be extremely curious to hear about the state of the print, although the very fact of an available 35mm print suggests that usable materials may be more available than previously thought. I'm sure I'm not alone in wishing this film upgraded more than any other Criterion release.
I attended the Sunday afternoon screening last week. The print was fairly damaged, I assume the one referenced in other messages here. It was nonetheless an enthralling experience to finally see it on the big screen. Can't wait for the (unique) screening of Marketa Lazarova in about a month.

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dad1153
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#289 Post by dad1153 » Sun Apr 28, 2013 3:43 am

So I saw "Andrei Rublev" (i.e. "The Passion According to Andrei") for the first time at a rather-packed AFA screening Saturday night. My second Tarkovsky, though to be honest I don't remember much from my years-ago viewing of "Solaris" other than I was mad it hadn't lived-up to the 'Russia's answer to 2001: A Space Odyssey' hype someone used to talk me into seeing it (I know, I was dumb). I was pumped to see this and was eager-beaver as the film started. The opening moments with the balloon flight were awesome and establish early the 'gravity-defying neutral POV' angles that would come in stronger in the 2nd half. Then suddenly the movie got excrutiating, dull, pretentious and boring, like instantly, to the point that I don't remember anything but odd flashes/images and scenes from the first two hours. I honestly don't remember falling asleep, at all, but I must have because other patrons around me were giving me some mean looks (and I'm a heavy snorer). Either that or the movie just put me in a coma-like trance or something for two hours. During the 10 min. intermission I seriously considered leaving because I was mentally trying to recap the movie's plot/characters and I was coming empty about most of anything except the balloon flight and the jester with the exposed derriere. Neither the entirety of "The Human Condition" or "Hitler: A Film from Germany" (watched on the same AFA screen) had sucked the life out of me like those first two hours of "Andrei Rublev," and nobody was more surprised about this than me.

Glad I stuck for the 2nd half though (and also read this thread from start to finish before posting). Hate to come across as the type of person that hated the first half of "Titanic" because the ship sinking was where the action is (I prefer the 1st half actually), but the invasion of Vladimir and the plight of Boriska constructing the big bell with the other villagers (with the Durochka segment in-between) were some awe-inspiring, they-don't-make-movies-like-this cinema moments. It was also refreshing to see a biopic about an artist that skews the expected notes (except perhaps the 'lowest moment in his life' which would be pretty much of the 2nd half before the color montage at the end) and doesn't show Andrei lifting a finger to paint but instead shows the state of life surrounding him that inspired the self-repressed artiste to paint again. Nikolay Burlyaev's fake confidence really makes you care about the plight of Boriska (I was actually tense as hell wondering whether that bell was going to ring or not) and Nikolai Sergeyev almost steals the movie as Theopanes (especially during the post-attack conversation with Andrei). I really need to see this again to try and piece together what is it about the first two hours of the movie that I either saw and forgot immediately or knocked me cold, but all I have access to is the non-anamorphic decades-old Criterion DVD everyone here's bitching about. On the strength of the 2nd half of it though "Andrei Rublev" is making me wondering why I haven't gotten around to opening the "Ivan's Childhood" DVD and "Solaris" Blu-ray on two of my many kevyip piles.

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Black Hat
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#290 Post by Black Hat » Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:06 pm

dad1153 wrote:the movie got excrutiating, dull, pretentious and boring, like instantly, to the point that I don't remember anything but odd flashes/images and scenes from the first two hours. I honestly don't remember falling asleep, at all, but I must have because other patrons around me were giving me some mean looks (and I'm a heavy snorer). Either that or the movie just put me in a coma-like trance or something for two hours. During the 10 min. intermission I seriously considered leaving
Funny you mention this, Rublev is one of my favs and Saturday was my first time seeing it on a big screen, having the DVD I've watched the film a bunch of times, most recently the 180 minute cut on Mosfilm's youtube channel not too long ago but for some reason on Saturday part one had the same effect on me. I conked out not once but twice and contemplated getting the hell out of there before remembering the bell sequence would make it all better.

During the intermission I had a funny exchange with two girls sitting right behind me. I overheard one say to the other that she doesn't know why his other film is called Stalker. Naturally I turned around to explain why but before I did I asked if they had seen the film to which the one who didn't said that she had but didn't remember that part. How anybody can watch Stalker and not get that is beyond my realm of comprehension but her subsequent death stare and attitude for exposing her lie was further motivation for me and my big head to stick it out if for no other reason than to obstruct her view of the rest of the film. People are funny.

For those interested in the print it was a pretty old, beat up Kino one but for the parts I was awake for it was still great to see the majesty of Rublev on the big screen.

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hearthesilence
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#291 Post by hearthesilence » Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:37 pm

I couldn't make it to Anthology but I've seen the 180 minute cut twice in 35mm and it is definitely amazing to see on the big screen. (I probably have a soft spot for any great black & white widescreen film in general.) Wishful thinking, but maybe they can find the elements needed to strike a better looking version of the original cut.

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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#292 Post by Zot! » Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:09 pm

Black Hat wrote:During the intermission I had a funny exchange with two girls sitting right behind me. I overheard one say to the other that she doesn't know why his other film is called Stalker. Naturally I turned around to explain why but before I did I asked if they had seen the film to which the one who didn't said that she had but didn't remember that part.
I just looked it up on Wikipedia, because I didn't remember that part either. So it's just an invented profession, like Blade Runner or whatever. Good work, smartypants, you chased the last two girls in the world at a Tarkovsky screening away.

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Black Hat
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#293 Post by Black Hat » Tue Apr 30, 2013 8:01 pm

HA! You know to my surprise there were a few girls there that night, as for the two I was talking about I overheard them saying wow at the end, so the one's distaste for me didn't matter.

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dad1153
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#294 Post by dad1153 » Tue Apr 30, 2013 8:05 pm

^^^ There was a woman sitting next to me and, every few minutes, would whisper spoken lines from the movie and/or re-interpret some of them in Russian (I guess) to the guy she was sitting with. A little annoying, but "Andrei Rublev's" 2nd half set-pieces were so awesome I didn't mind (or care) for the yapping.

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DasMarcos
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#295 Post by DasMarcos » Sat May 11, 2013 12:39 pm

Count me in as another viewer who would love for Criterion to do a reissue of Andrei Rublev in BD. I've been looking over the 185 minute versions available in Russia and decided to order the Digital Element release online, with the help of my Russian friend mind you. It should be a treat and I'll report back here as to my impressions versus the 205 minute cut. If anyone else is interested in obtaining this version let me know and I can point you in the right direction. Also note, the Digital Element BD should not be confused with the Close Up release, the latter of which does NOT include English subtitles.

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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#296 Post by nils » Sat May 11, 2013 5:22 pm

Andrei Rublev release BD from Digital Element it's very well (Close-up release is worse than DE), but - The Passion According to Andrei, only Criterion can make this release. Repose one's hopes in Criterion.

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Yakushima
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#297 Post by Yakushima » Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:32 pm

Criterion just posted on their Facebook an amazing behind the scene footage from the making of "Andrei Rublev". A hopeful sign? [-o<

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Matt
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#298 Post by Matt » Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:30 pm

A December release would be a hell of a Christmas present (Hanukkah being very early this year, I guess those who celebrate it will have to settle for Zatoichi. And sorry, Eid-Al-Fitr celebrants. Your gift was The Earrings of Madame de....)

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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#299 Post by J » Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:48 pm

Matt wrote:A December release would be a hell of a Christmas present (Hanukkah being very early this year, I guess those who celebrate it will have to settle for Zatoichi. And sorry, Eid-Al-Fitr celebrants. Your gift was The Earrings of Madame de....)
There's also Eid-Al-Adha... We'll settle for 3 Films By Rossellini...

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HerrSchreck
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#300 Post by HerrSchreck » Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:55 pm

Christ what I would give to upgrade that damned film in a quality and well supplemented HD presentation. Proof that miracles do happen--Tarkovsky had a knack for whipping the impossible out of the medium.

And yes I love the 205 minute cut.

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